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Post by Dave on Apr 29, 2013 22:49:17 GMT -6
But you watch grown men mount each other while the guy on bottom wraps his legs around the other guy too? Sounds like a kind of "wrestling" to me
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Tyler
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Post by Tyler on Apr 29, 2013 22:54:09 GMT -6
I was grouping Boxing in with the likes of Kick Boxing and Wrestling because it is a completely one dimensional sport. Not talking about ratings or history. As for saying 'For every UFC fan now, there was one for K-1 fighting back in the day.' Im pretty sure K-1 was never as big as MMA is now. Not even close.
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Post by Dave on Apr 29, 2013 22:56:11 GMT -6
I was grouping Boxing in with the likes of Kick Boxing and Wrestling because it is a completely one dimensional sport. Not talking about ratings or history. As for saying 'For every UFC fan now, there was one for K-1 fighting back in the day.' Im pretty sure K-1 was never as big as MMA is now. Not even close. It's not, but it was as crazy an example as you said boxing being the equal of like kickboxing. Much more goes into boxing then it gets credit for was the big point I was trying to make. Like I said, I have a close friend who boxed so I try to learn a bit about it so I can wrack his brain about his past.
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Tyler
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Post by Tyler on Apr 29, 2013 23:53:27 GMT -6
There is much more to every sport then given credit for. Kick Boxing and Wrestling have a TON of things that go into and the people at the top are exactly that... The best at their craft. You cant talk like Boxing is far superior to all of these other sports just like I cant talk like the MMA is far superior Boxing. They all have a lot that goes into them and you either like it or hate it. Im a fan of MMA and dont care for the other because they are one dimensional in my opinion, that's all Im saying lol.
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Post by DuncanFan on Apr 30, 2013 2:58:32 GMT -6
But you watch grown men mount each other while the guy on bottom wraps his legs around the other guy too? Sounds like a kind of "wrestling" to me Athletes who don't pull punches/kicks and who break each others limbs are far from the pathetic soap opera that wrestling is. 2 men are put in a cage/ring, the best man wins. No steel chairs, "knocked out" referees, fake punches, ridiculous story lines, or other pathetic attempts at drama are included. And there's a huge difference between legitimate wrestling that's used in MMA or seen in the Olympics than WWE. The fact that you even compare the 2 is laughable. It's like comparing Harlem Globetrotter games to the NBA.
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Drew
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Post by Drew on Apr 30, 2013 8:33:16 GMT -6
But you watch grown men mount each other while the guy on bottom wraps his legs around the other guy too? Sounds like a kind of "wrestling" to me Till you've been in that situation in training or real life it's hard to realize just how much skill and stamina it takes to maintain any position on the ground. Even holding guard is a pretty life or death struggle against a well trained killer who wants to punch and elbow you in the face. I've done a buch of martial arts, have a black belt in one, and I could barely last 2 minutes during my first jiu-jitsu sessions. I know what it looks like, two guys lying there, but you're using nearly every muscle group in an aerobic/anaerobic struggle.
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Post by Derek on Apr 30, 2013 9:16:09 GMT -6
I remember the first day I tried to go through some light grappling work-outs (was in best shape of my life when I walked in) ... I was dry heaving 20-30 minutes later outside. I've watch marathon runners come in for some workouts and not make it through it. Insane.
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Post by Madrid on Apr 30, 2013 9:47:33 GMT -6
I've been doing jiu-jitsu for about 3 1/2 years off and on, twice/week. It's by far the most intense and effective cardio I've ever experienced. When we do positional sparring for about half an hour, I feel like my entire life has been drained out of me. I'm sure boxing is right up there, but when you combine them all, you get an incredible work-out, even if it's only for 5-10 minutes.
As far as boxing/MMA goes, as said above, one is entirely one-dimensional. MMA boxing is actually entirely different from normal boxing because you have to beware of elbows, takedowns, and eye pokes. It affects everything involving your stance, ability to throw combinations, and footwork. Plus, the Muay Thai clinch, underhooks, and cage pushing actually have real consequences. And lastly, I have a pair of UFC gloves, and those things don't give you much padding. When you hit something, you hurt. Boxing gloves are like Sock'em Boppers compared to MMA gloves.
As for future match-ups in the UFC, after JDS destroys Mark Hunt, I really hope we get to see Nelson-Hunt. That would be too much fun.
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Tyler
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Post by Tyler on Apr 30, 2013 10:19:25 GMT -6
Nelson-Hunt would be a fun fight. As for you comment about boxing gloves, boxing gloves are actually more dangerous then UFC gloves. UFC gloves weight 5-6 oz where boxing gloves weight 16 oz and provide the hand with a lot of padding so boxers are able to train and punch as hard as they physically can without breaking their hands as much. Boxing gloves also provide more protection while defending so shots to the body are more open and you get hit with a punch as well as a 1lb glove. On top of that, the more protection/padding on the hands allows boxers to take more hits without going out where as UFC you'll get one punched. It's weird because they actually have advantages and disadvantages.
It kind of reminds me of Helmets in the NFL. How the more cushion they get the harder they hit with their head when back in the day they had leather helmets and didt tackle with the head ever.
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Drew
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Post by Drew on Apr 30, 2013 10:40:32 GMT -6
Nelson-Hunt would be a fun fight. As for you comment about boxing gloves, boxing gloves are actually more dangerous then UFC gloves. UFC gloves weight 5-6 oz where boxing gloves weight 16 oz and provide the hand with a lot of padding so boxers are able to train and punch as hard as they physically can without breaking their hands as much. Boxing gloves also provide more protection while defending so shots to the body are more open and you get hit with a punch as well as a 1lb glove. On top of that, the more protection/padding on the hands allows boxers to take more hits without going out where as UFC you'll get one punched. It's weird because they actually have advantages and disadvantages. It kind of reminds me of Helmets in the NFL. How the more cushion they get the harder they hit with their head when back in the day they had leather helmets and didt tackle with the head ever. Just had a long talk about this with my grandfathers friend/student who's an 8th degree blackbelt in TKD. The brutal knockouts you see in UFC highlights are actually far less damaging then a 12 round distance fight in boxing. Not to mention the fact that a knockdown in UFC almost always signals the end of the fight while boxing allows you to continue if u can beat the count. The accumulation of head strikes in boxing is really frightening when you start to think about CTE and other degenerative diseases. It's actually pretty easy to recover from a KO no matter how bad if the fight is stopped correctly. A lifetime of taking hundreds of head shots is what really ruins you. Not saying this doesn't happen in MMA, but it's a rarity compared to boxing where it's the norm. I actually think MMA being relatively young works in its favor because there's no right way to do things. New systems of fighting and training g methods are constantly introduced, with new science always being looked at. I'm sure a guy like Greg Jackson is well versed in the dangers of long term brain trauma and I doubt he encourages boxing style gym wars.
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Post by Madrid on Apr 30, 2013 11:28:08 GMT -6
Nelson-Hunt would be a fun fight. As for you comment about boxing gloves, boxing gloves are actually more dangerous then UFC gloves. UFC gloves weight 5-6 oz where boxing gloves weight 16 oz and provide the hand with a lot of padding so boxers are able to train and punch as hard as they physically can without breaking their hands as much. Boxing gloves also provide more protection while defending so shots to the body are more open and you get hit with a punch as well as a 1lb glove. On top of that, the more protection/padding on the hands allows boxers to take more hits without going out where as UFC you'll get one punched. It's weird because they actually have advantages and disadvantages. I wasn't arguing for one or the other. I was just explaining the differences between boxing and MMA boxing. Yes, you can hit a lot harder with boxing gloves because you aren't as likely to damage your hand. It just changes strategy altogether, which makes transitioning between the two very difficult. It's yet another reason why MMA boxers don't turn into professional boxers, and why professional boxers, in addition to learning other disciplines, have to change their style of boxing to fit with MMA.
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Tyler
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Post by Tyler on Apr 30, 2013 13:38:49 GMT -6
I was just saying its not really sock em bopers.. Well it kind of is but not in the sense that they are less damaging.
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Post by Drew on Jun 14, 2013 9:57:01 GMT -6
what's everyone's prediction for Evans v Henderson?
its funny a few years ago this was one of my dream fights... still has the makings of a classic, or might be a boring 5 round decision.
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Post by San Antonio on Jun 14, 2013 10:10:45 GMT -6
Rashad should win but after his pathetic fight against little nog, I wouldn't be suprised if henderson won.
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Post by Drew on Jun 14, 2013 10:14:15 GMT -6
Rashad should win but after his pathetic fight against little nog, I wouldn't be suprised if henderson won. yeah smart money is on rashad. but i could never vote against the man with the h-bomb for a right hand.
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bignasty
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Post by bignasty on Jun 15, 2013 19:34:12 GMT -6
what's everyone's prediction for Evans v Henderson? its funny a few years ago this was one of my dream fights... still has the makings of a classic, or might be a boring 5 round decision. Evans is going to win an easy, boring 50-45 fight. He's too fast for Henderson, and all Evans will have to do is dance around the outside and circle away from the H Bomb to get the win.
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Drew
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Post by Drew on Jun 16, 2013 10:05:32 GMT -6
ended up being a pretty lackluster main-card. shawn jordan impressed me a lot, more so for his choice of entrance music than anything else though
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bignasty
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Post by bignasty on Jun 16, 2013 11:29:19 GMT -6
I didn't see the fights but judging from the play by play I was wrong about how the fight would play out and I guess a lot of people are saying Hendo should have won.
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Drew
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Post by Drew on Jun 16, 2013 11:34:50 GMT -6
I didn't see the fights but judging from the play by play I was wrong about how the fight would play out and I guess a lot of people are saying Hendo should have won. could have gone either way. kind of showed me that neither of these two are anywhere near ready for another title shot.
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Post by DuncanFan on Jun 17, 2013 0:57:17 GMT -6
Everyone I was rooting for yesterday lost... Woodley (mainly because I hate Shields), Roy, Hendo, Barry. Shitty night. Rashad's down to fight Glover. I think that would be a nice fight to really test Teixiera to see if he's really a contender.
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Post by Derek on Jun 17, 2013 7:59:33 GMT -6
My thoughts:
1) As an LSU fan and from Louisiana, watching Pat and Shawn fight was gonna be bitter sweet. That being said, I think Shawn is proving he can hang with the big boys and certainly got himself another main card fight. What an athlete... anyone see that backflip?
2) Please stop letting women fight in UFC, that was terrible.
3) Proof yet again that winning isn't everything, Jimmo was no fun to watch and will likely be an undercard fight next time out.
4) Roy Nelson... you don't take your training serious and get picked apart by a solid at best up and comer. You don't belong in the sport unless you plan on losing weight and becoming serious about your work.
5) I found this to be a great fight but I thought every main event was going to 5 rounds? Did Dana know that 42 is just too old for Hendo? Dana needs to give him a fight against a scrub and let him go out on top, his time is done. Suga looked like a smart fighter for once. Kept moving and mixing it up. Needs to fight another ranked opponent then maybe get a second go at Bones, he's fared the best against him away.
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bignasty
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Post by bignasty on Jun 17, 2013 10:55:29 GMT -6
Great commentary, but how can you say Roy Nelson doesn't deserve to be in the sport? He may not have looked great last weekend - but before that fight he had three fights in a row with 1st round (T)KO victories. I don't care what he looks like, the dude has the best chin in his division and clearly has knockout power. Combine that with his solid ground game and you've got a good gatekeeper HW who probably belongs on the main card in the UFC, and definitely belongs in the sport.
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Post by Derek on Jun 17, 2013 11:08:51 GMT -6
His cardio is worse than anyone in this league. He was winded just walking up to the cage. All he does is get hit and throw haymakers. That really isn't MMA, sure he has a blackbelt in jujitsu but he's too fat to get on the grown and use any of it. He needs to lose weight and drop down to 205, you can't tell me there isn't 40 lbs of fat in that stomach. If he REALLY wanted to be his best, he would do it. Not to mention he turns 37 this week. Compare that to a 33 year old Suga who is still refining his craft and getting better (best shape he's ever looked). I just doubt Roy has the drive to get to the top and really doesn't interest me seeing him lose a fight or get lucky with a haymaker and win it. Go to kickboxing or boxing if that is your game plan.
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Drew
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Post by Drew on Jun 17, 2013 11:09:52 GMT -6
My thoughts: 1) As an LSU fan and from Louisiana, watching Pat and Shawn fight was gonna be bitter sweet. That being said, I think Shawn is proving he can hang with the big boys and certainly got himself another main card fight. What an athlete... anyone see that backflip? 2) Please stop letting women fight in UFC, that was terrible. 3) Proof yet again that winning isn't everything, Jimmo was no fun to watch and will likely be an undercard fight next time out. 4) Roy Nelson... you don't take your training serious and get picked apart by a solid at best up and comer. You don't belong in the sport unless you plan on losing weight and becoming serious about your work. 5) I found this to be a great fight but I thought every main event was going to 5 rounds? Did Dana know that 42 is just too old for Hendo? Dana needs to give him a fight against a scrub and let him go out on top, his time is done. Suga looked like a smart fighter for once. Kept moving and mixing it up. Needs to fight another ranked opponent then maybe get a second go at Bones, he's fared the best against him away. 1) Was a great knockout but in the heavyweight division flash knockouts like that due little to prove your ready for the top dogs. 2) Honestly this was the first 'meh' women's fight so far. And if you don't like Ronda Rousey somethings wrong. 3) I agree, Shields win was so lackluster to me. 4) He had 2 weeks notice on this fight. He definitely belongs in the UFC, don't let his weight fool you. 5) Dana said the two had agreed to a 3 round fight before it ended up being slotted as the main event.
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Post by Derek on Jun 17, 2013 11:15:16 GMT -6
My thoughts: 1) As an LSU fan and from Louisiana, watching Pat and Shawn fight was gonna be bitter sweet. That being said, I think Shawn is proving he can hang with the big boys and certainly got himself another main card fight. What an athlete... anyone see that backflip? 2) Please stop letting women fight in UFC, that was terrible. 3) Proof yet again that winning isn't everything, Jimmo was no fun to watch and will likely be an undercard fight next time out. 4) Roy Nelson... you don't take your training serious and get picked apart by a solid at best up and comer. You don't belong in the sport unless you plan on losing weight and becoming serious about your work. 5) I found this to be a great fight but I thought every main event was going to 5 rounds? Did Dana know that 42 is just too old for Hendo? Dana needs to give him a fight against a scrub and let him go out on top, his time is done. Suga looked like a smart fighter for once. Kept moving and mixing it up. Needs to fight another ranked opponent then maybe get a second go at Bones, he's fared the best against him away. 1) Was a great knockout but in the heavyweight division flash knockouts like that due little to prove your ready for the top dogs. 2) Honestly this was the first 'meh' women's fight so far. And if you don't like Ronda Rousey somethings wrong. 3) I agree, Shields win was so lackluster to me. 4) He had 2 weeks notice on this fight. He definitely belongs in the UFC, don't let his weight fool you. 5) Dana said the two had agreed to a 3 round fight before it ended up being slotted as the main event. 1) Agreed but Pat Berry is tough, to knock him out at least proves he has the power. He's just beyond raw right now. 2) I know but come on, tell me you stayed awake in that fight! 3) Shields was undercard, I was referring to the Jimmo vs. Igor fight. 4) Then turn it down. You just stepped in the ring and got completely destroyed by a guy who hasn't beat anyone and got got by Struve. Very bad. 5) Makes sense, sad to see Hendo decline as he is.
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